Wednesday, 13 February 2013

Debbie's serious thoughts of the month



Crossdreaming/autogynephilia is probably the only sexuality about which most serious discussion focuses on its cause.

I think this is harmful for crossdreamers and for the development of a crossdreaming community.

In a post of 16 January 2013, Jack Molay, who coined the term, defined mtf crossdreamers clearly as 'male-bodied persons who get aroused by the idea of being a woman'. I don't think that the term has always been employed so unambiguously, but I thoroughly approve of this clear-cut definition. If this definition is stuck to tightly, then I would like 'crossdreaming'  to be used in preference to 'autogynephilia'. It sounds so much nicer, doesn't it? Furthermore Jack has not so much developed as created the crossdreaming community, out of an undoubted strong desire to help us all, so it is appropriate that we use his term (even if he has gone a bit over the top in his anti-Blanchard fervour recently).

Blanchard has been condemned by many, in no uncertain terms, for treating gender dysphoria as a symptom of autogynephilia. I think there can also be harm in treating crossdreaming as a symptom of dysphoria, less because it might not be one than because this belittles the importance of the sexuality in its own right.

So I think it is very important to distinguish crossdreaming from dysphoria. Some crossdreamers suffer from dysphoria and some do not. It is our crossdreaming sexuality that unites us, and such unity is important. What I think is crucial is to distinguish the dysphoria of dysphoric crossdreamers from the crossdreaming of dysphoric crossdreamers.

I am very fortunate not to suffer from dysphoria. I am all for dysphorics supporting each other. Should dysphorics transition? That is not for me to say. This very difficult decision should be up to each individual, perhaps guided by the advice of knowledgeable, supportive others (as long as those others are not motivated by a political agenda to get people to transition, a disdain for trans people who don't  - or the opposite motivations). But in principle I am all in favour of men turning into women.

Crossdreaming is a sexuality, and sexuality is a very important part of life. This is true for dysphorics and non-dysphorics alike. Sexuality is inherently pleasurable, and a strong crossdreaming community can help dysphorics and non-dysphorics alike enjoy and feel good about their sexuality.

If crossdreaming is not distinguished from dysphoria, then serious focus on the sexuality is liable to get swamped by focus on dysphoria and the possibility of transitioning.

Should crossdreamers transition on account of their sexuality? If they want to because they think it a turn-on then I have no objection, but I would advise them to think hard about it first, especially about the difference between fantasy and rl. I doubt many people actually transition without a deep conviction that it is right for them, but there are probably quite a few non-transitioners who feel cowardly because they have not gone down what others have advocated as their only path to fulfilment.

Acknowledging oneself to be a crossdreamer, to have such an unorthodox and disdained sexuality, is not easy. That is why I think it is important that there is an affirmative community, outside of TG pornography, that helps individual crossdreamers to embrace their sexuality without shame, that doesn't think of crossdreaming as something to be got rid off, either through therapy or though transitioning.

I don't think it is helpful for people acknowledging their crossdreaming sexuality to have the serious, difficult issue of transitioning thrust in their face. Acknowledging crossdreaming is hard enough in itself. Uncertain feelings about the sexuality can be confused with dysphoria. The belief 'if you crossdream you must be transsexual, therefore you should transition' ought not to be allowed to dominate crossdreaming culture.

Crossdreaming is a fascinating sexuality. Important contexts for it are:

- cultural gender roles

- the relationship between inner and outer life

- the relationship between self and other

- the relationship between sexual and non-sexual realms

- the differences between online and offline life

Aspects of crossdreaming that can be explored, beyond the element of gender, are:

- its relationship to introversion

- its relationship to male heterosexuality

- its relationship to other sexual predilections such as masochism

- its relationship to other fantasies of transformation.

Relationships that I do not encourage the study of - beyond serious scientific investigations - are relationships to mental illness, low self-esteem, sense of failure as a male. It doesn't do a community or an individual good to dwell on such themes: it can lead to an indulgent wallowing that serves no one.

But investigation, even comprehension, is much less important than the development of an affirmative community.

Our sexuality is a sexuality, not a symptom.

25 comments:

  1. As Holli, I've been weighed and measured, and I have been found wanting... wanting many things on both sides of the fence, that is, though ultimately I've been led to this truth: I can never give up the life I live now, but I also believe there is some way to satisfy my female brain.

    I also believe in fairy tales... more as living myths of the toils of humanity, meant to know ourselves and build our worlds accordingly. I understand my life to be a full blown mythic tale in progress. I have an amazing power, which helps me see & interact with things in ways most others cannot. I don't know how to use this power yet, but I am the Heroine of this tale, which of course means I'm bound to discover it.

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    1. As Holli, you've been weighed and measured here at Deborah Descends and been found a superstar (but I'm still going to tie you up anyway).

      We are all monarchs of our own inner realms. We can be weak monarchs, or glorious, glamorous, mighty monarchs. xx

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  2. "Jack Molay, who coined the term, defined mtf crossdreamers clearly as 'male-bodied persons who get aroused by the idea of being a woman'. I don't think that the term has always been employed so unambiguously, but I thoroughly approve of this clear-cut definition."

    >> Are you sure 'arousal' is an unalienable part of crossdreaming?

    While personally I do get aroused by the idea of being a girl, there is also that darker dysphoric side to this in my case, which induces very different kind of deep sad longing filled dreams and fantasies, entirely void of any arousal as far as I can tell.. but they are still dreams and fantasies about being a girl, so isn't it still crossdreaming.. no?

    And couldn't the darker side potentially exist without the arousing side for some people?
    And if it could, wouldn't those people still be crossdreamers too?

    Or.. Am I making an incorrect presupposition while equating 'arousal' with 'sexual arousal'?

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    1. Hi Lils. There's no absolute authority about the definition: there has been ambivalence/inconsistency. We can look at how Jack uses the term and how everyone uses the term. But Jack's recent definition seems good to me - I think 'arousal' does mean 'sexual arousal'. If we don't regard ourselves as a community based explicitly on a common sexuality then I fear we just blend into 'transgender', with consequences outlined above.

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  3. I think that Jack's definition of "arousal by the thought of being a woman" is misleading and obscures the breadth of ways in which one relates oneself to femininity. Perhaps one could say that anatomy is a predominant symbolism among the self-identified anatomic niched, of which I am not.

    I much prefer Jasper Gregory's "relation-to-the self through the feminine social imaginary". Surely essential to a phenomenology!

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  4. Thanks wxh. For me personally the body is central. I don't fantasise about having feminine attributes and a male body. xx

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  5. Even when a theme may be anatomic, I think each narrative instance of arousal is composed of more abstract ways in which one relates through femininity. Like our spat about the dresses (I knew you thought my dress was prettier!)

    I have a parallel condition like which you stated, whereas what I experience as the idea itself of androphilia as being a super sexy symbolism of femininity, the idea of androphilia on part of a male body is a turn off. But the symbolism of androphilia doesn't necessitate a male bodied self figuring also in the narrative.

    Do you read any trans/feminization fiction?

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  6. Thanks again, wxh. xx

    I find feminization fiction rather predictable.

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    1. The stories I've seen/heard/read do tend to mostly follow same pattern, ie. its always some normal straight guy who gets turned and he is initially totally against it and is forced to adobt some stereotypical female dress and manners, and is put through one hilarious awkward situation after another and gradually learns to enjoy being a girl...

      Predictable ? I guess... But I still like some of them...

      Putting some character who actually dreams about such things into such a situation just wouldn't make a good story?

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  7. I have some fantasies which don't have the arousal component in it. One such fantasy is being a beautiful angel-like woman who can make any sad soul happy by her smile and talk. Another fantasy is being a fairy warrior woman, who is a protector to the weak. These two kinds of fantasies spring from somewhere in the depths of my feminine psyche. But, as far as I remember these don't trigger arousal, but invokes a softness within me that can't be described by words!

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    1. I definitely got such fantasies too... But while I can't really say where they spring from within me, some songs tend to feed them, like 'the voice' and the 'fields of gold' and others by the celtic woman group...

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  8. These sounds like lovely fantasies, Jaya. I think a fantasy that produces a nice soft feeling can rank alongside overtly arousing ones. xx

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    1. There is a big difference though... I am not sure how it is for Jaya, but for me there is...

      While both kinds of fantasies feel good in their own way in the moment, the sexual fantaises being exhilarating and these others inducing a warm peaceful contented kind of feeling...

      But while with the ecstatic sexual fantasies there is the potential for release and fulfilment afterward, with these fantasies, there is no release, no endorphin surges, nothing good, only the sad lingering longing...

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    2. Like the difference between making love and the longing to make love

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    3. One set of fantasies is fueled by arousal, they are great and exhilarating and can be mostly managed quite easily by simply masturbating.. and when I do I am left feeling good for a while afterwards.. So they are all good...

      The other set is fueled by some other things.. by a desire to be beautiful to my self, and lovable to others I guess and a desire to revel in the things that I would love to but for most part can't. Things that most girls are free to revel in to their to their heart's content just because they were born girls... when I manage to get my self lost in one of these fantasies, the feeling is perhaps something like what a homesick person might feel when they finally get home... these fantasies are not tied to arousal and there is no managing them really when they surface, the only thing I can do is try and burry my self in something so I have no time to think and feel...

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  9. I find it kind of hard to wrap my head around the idea that you don't suffer from any dysphoria...

    Or when you say you don't suffer from dysphoria, do you just mean you don't feel it in any significant, debilitating level ?

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    1. I find it pretty bizarre that there are those of us who do not recognise (compartmentalize?) the presence of solely sexual AGP content all over the internet. Then again, AGP communities are almost completely made up of those who worry about gender issues, so I think that gives the constituents an impression based on a collective reinforcement of eachothers notions and generalities.

      I would emphasize that anything anyone is sexually aroused by, is present as an aching psychological longing, which can be thought of as "dysphoric". As Debs' emphasizes, the psychological context is determinate

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    2. No... I know there are tons of such stories and other media out there and I am something of a 'consumer' my self.

      And I wasn't referring to all crossdreamers in general... I have just gotten it in my head that Kate is or "should be" dysphoric.. as I get the feeling that she really is a girl, fitting that old girl trapped in a male body scenario, maybe my impression is all wrong, but that is the impression I get...

      And while I personally feel I am trapped in this body of mine, I don't really feel in anyway strongly that I am a girl in here, I just wish I was... and yet I think I am dysphoric... and it just seems to me, based on the impression I get that Kate should be more dysphoric than I am...

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    3. @Lils

      That's interesting that you think that. But I do not think 'oh, I do so wish I was a girl', really I don't. Maybe it's that I pour all my femininity into Deborah's online writing, which I do not claim to represent my whole being. But half the time when I'm writing as Deborah I'm just arguing philosophy in a way that I don't think of as girly at all. xxx

      @wxhluyp

      Yes, I do think that trans communities can have the effect of developing dysphoria. If you are deeply into trans, as your sexuality pulls you into being, you will be inclined to identify as hardcore trans, which, in most paradigms, means transsexual. Proselytisers for transitioning encourage this, with their scorn for non-op transgender people. People who are not going to transition but who identify as transsexual are led to feel that their life is fundamentally false and doomed to deep unhappiness. This surely encourages dysphoria. Such attitudes might well be keeping crossdreamers away from earnest crossdreaming culture. They will stay isolated in their privacy as consumers of porn and furtive adopters of female online identities.

      Increasingly I think it could really help a lot of crossdreamers to have a non-porn crossdreaming culture focusing on the sexuality, away from people seriously considering transitioning.

      But I've said all this before, and I am tired. xxx

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  10. Hi Lils. I don't believe I do suffer from dysphoria. For those who think this an anomaly, my explanation would lie in the natures of fantasy, external reality, identity and gender construction.

    I might expand upon this in a future post. xx

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  11. Blanchard has been condemned by many, in no uncertain terms, for treating gender dysphoria as a symptom of autogynephilia.

    I think that's an inevitable consequence of his limited perspective. What I dislike most about his whole concept of AGP is that he takes an aspect of human sexuality and pathologizes it, places it outside human sexual variation. So it's no longer something people do, it's something people are. And it then becomes self-perpetuating: anyone who does "this" is now "that". Indeed , they do "this" because they are "that", and the cycle goes round and round. Instead of submitting to his hypothesis, I think it's much better to develop our own understandings. To which end, speaking personally...

    Yes, a lot of my sexual fantasies involve me taking on a "female" role, and a lot of them also incorporate "sex-change" so that I become "female" and often subsequently "wife". Blanchard would have me stop there: "you have AGP". Nuts to him. Analysing my own feelings, it's not a physical femaleness that's arousing exactly (though my fantasies may incorporate an idea of that), but the adoption of a non-heteronormative sexual role, an "opposite" heterosexual role. In the classical romantic stereotype, I want to be the "woman", I want to be desired, courted, and made love to. I want someone else to be the "man",

    Since I regard designating particular sexual roles "male" and "female" to be heteronormative nonsense, I therefore understand my sexuality not as a desire to be female, but simply of a type that is culturally regarded as female. Heteronormativity prescribes what a man's sexuality and a woman's sexuality is and should be, and in that framework mine fits in the "female" category. But I reject that prescription. It is a type of human sexuality, which happens to be mine (and the fact that I'm a man is ultimately irrelevant). Heteronormativity says it's "female". Nuts to heteronomativity too.

    Given all that, I could just fantasize about expressing my culturally "female" sexuality as a man – and yes, sometimes I do – but it takes more imagination and effort on my part. The cultural norms are more familiar, and are therefore more resonant and enjoyable. Or to put it another way (as wxhluyp quotes Jasper), I do better with a “relation-to-the self through the feminine social imaginary”. But this is sexual fantasy, and it's something I do, not something I am. I do not have a paraphilia invented by some gender-challenged arsehole of a sexologist in Canada.

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    1. Oh poor old Ray, everyone hates him so!

      I think the pathologising can be queered. A lot of people do do identity politics - they want to say 'this is what I am', not just 'this is what I do'.

      I do think it's good for people to identify with crossdreaming sexuality if they honestly experience it, rather than play down the sexuality lest it give trans a bad name. This doesn't mean that there is necessarily no more to trans feelings than sexuality, that sexuality is the ultimate cause. I don't know what is the ultimate cause; I don't think anyone does really for sure.

      Interesting thoughts J. I also feel more comfortable identifying with characteristics associated with the female rather than insisting on an absolute femaleness. x x

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  12. A lot of people do do identity politics - they want to say 'this is what I am', not just 'this is what I do'.

    Sure thing, no problem there. Identities are often very useful, in that they give us a place to stand, so to speak. I have "this is what I am" things too – such as "femme", for instance :)

    But my fantasies are something I do, rather than something I am. I mean, they're fantasies, aren't they. All Blanchard has done is take a particular (and arbitrary) set of sexual fantasies at face value, given it a silly name, and then applied it to people. He's either an idiot or a charlatan; I'm not sure which.

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  13. Oh lets not argue any more. Happy Easter J! xx

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  14. yes, I've been feeling quite cantankerous recently
    enough of that for now ;)
    happy easter, debs

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